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{slight rant journal}

Journal Entry: Sat Nov 10, 2012, 8:52 PM


before i say anything, this journal is not directed at anyone in particular. it's just a general thing which was sparked by multiple things and multiple people.
there is something often complained about, and sometimes mistakenly - that is, courtesy on dA (and on art orientated websites in general).

here are some examples:

what is rude  -
:bulletblack: not thanking someone for a commission or gift
:bulletblack: demanding/ordering instead of asking
:bulletblack: ignoring your comment/note in regards to a commission/owed art/owed points/similiar
:bulletblack: stealing something and using popularity to defend themselves.
:bulletblack: swearing at or aggressively attacking someone for drawing/writing about something you don't like (e.g a pairing or character)

what is not rude -
:bulletblack: not thanking for favourites/every non-urgent comment (the habit of regularly checking feedback messages DOES NOT CHANGE because of popularity - the time spent replying to those, however, does)
:bulletblack: not complimenting you on your art while offering constructive criticism (compliments are a BONUS, not a requirement to 'soften the blow')
:bulletblack: having friends on deviantART but not being friends with you.


The last two i feel are too often mistaken as rude, when they're NOT - if you ask for criticism, unless you specify that you're asking for compliments and criticism, nobody is obligated to praise your work while pointing out it's flaws.
A critique that has no praise DOES NOT MEAN it is flaming your work, unhelpful or 'trolling' you.

A rude/unhelpful/flaming type critique is:
:bulletred: rude or insulting (using slurs or swears, e.g "this is a piece of shit."
:bulletred: offers no actual advice
:bulletred: says they could've done this in their sleep/with their poop/eyes shut/in two minutes flat/etc
:bulletred: does not contain any legitimate criticism of the work itself.

a constructive critique is:
:bulletgreen: pointing out flaws or errors in your work.
:bulletgreen: suggesting ways to fix/improve it.
:bulletgreen: commenting on the overall piece in an analytical manner.

cool optional bonuses to a good critique:
:bulletblack: compliments, or praise of your work!
:bulletblack: redlines or links to resource materials!

and also the last point i want to make is people who consider it rude when a popular deviant - or anyone, really - won't be friends with them, or has a 'private' group of friends they draw gift art for/rp with/make plans with.
public service announcement - no one, no one is obligated to be friends with you. it's not fun and it's not nice but forcing friendships doesn't work either. People are allowed to have friendship groups. It's a fact of life - trying to fling yourself into the circle or group probably won't help you maintain those friendships in the long run.

p.s it's really not cool to try and befriend an artist just so you can ask them for free art

sorry for the nasty journal.
If you guys have any other courtesy do's and don't's, feel free to share them in the comments.

Add a Comment:
 
:iconpeachshark:
peachshark Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
thanks for the support guys ;v; i'm glad a lot of you agree with my points!!
Reply
:iconplantress:
Plantress Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Student Writer
Thank you for all of this. Especially the stuff about critiques. It's very nice when someone points out stuff you're good at as well was what you need to improve on, but I'm tired to seeing critiques that are so much praise and apologizing that it's hard to tell what they're trying to offer a critique on.
Reply
:iconmafiavamp:
MafiaVamp Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012
Agreed. :thumbsup:
Reply
:iconarrancar5489:
arrancar5489 Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012
Absolutely perfect♥
Reply
:iconilluminatedfantasy:
IlluminatedFantasy Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
i agree on the rude part because this girl commission me and still haven't replied and not follow my commissions rules... ^^;
Reply
:iconbeeshoneypot:
BeesHoneypot Featured By Owner Nov 11, 2012
All sorts of win in this journal~ :iconclapplz:
Well said bby~ I absolutely aggree with you.
Reply
:iconatalentedartist:
ATalentedArtist Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
I agree but the first part. Most people might be gone from dA for a while to deal with life..other than that..I do agree.
Reply
:iconfunshinecharms:
FunshineCharms Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Artisan Crafter
I think this journal sounds perfectly fair. ^^
Reply
:iconbeastlybrains:
BeastlyBrains Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012
I agree with everything you said in this journal. There some people on dA that are plain rude and it lessens the fun for the rest of us just trying to share our art and discover other art. Also, the mix-ups of the things you pointed out make things worse. It's either people complaining about other people being rude OR people complaining about other people being rude and bashing on them when simply, they were just giving a simple critique - maybe they didn't mean it in a harsh way?
Also, I can't exactly say this from personal experience because I'm not very popular on here, but I like to sometimes check up on my favorite artists page and I constantly see people bashing them for not answering their note...or replying to one of their comments... It's not like they need to focus their attention to every. single. person. People need to understand that most artists on here are students and hard workers in the real lifes and can't spend every hour of every day on dA.

...It just frustrates me B(
Reply
:iconjeroaid:
JeroAid Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Student Digital Artist
Can I kiss you for all of this.
On the PS part, I hate that. I've had people who try to be my friend, and right when I think they're
a good person, they go and say "Hey can you draw my OC for me (:" Like. No. I just won't...

I tend to get accused of that a lot, but the thing is, I don't flat out ask for art from a friend. It's rude. Like,
if I know they're free and bored I'll be like "Hey wanna' do an art trade?" Or sometimes people are really cool
and like "Do you want a free _____ bby?" Idek why, but it's only ever this one girl that accuses me of it.

ANOTHER DONT.
YOU DO NOT.
ASK ME
TO BE FRIENDS WITH YOU
A MAGICAL FRIENDSHIP
ISNT GOING TO FORM
WITHIN 2 SECONDS OF YOU ASKING
A lot of my friendships on DA are like, I commissioned them/collabed with them/traded with them etc and we just kept talking and got along. Or I tried to be friends with them, found a bunch of common interests and then became friends (ie. costmary and bonestuck). Friendship, is not something you force on someone, it grows over time. If it's fast, it happens fast. If it's slow, then wait.

AND FINALLY
DO NOT
ASK ME
IF YOU CAN BUY MY OC OFF ME
JUST THATS RUDE
HE/SHE IS MY BABY
AINT GONNA SELL THEM
GOOD BYE BUT THANK YOU FOR LIKING THEM
//weep

some people these days cry
Reply
:iconseraphim-art:
Seraphim-Art Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I admit that most of this I agree with. To be fairly honest, I highly disagree with your point on criticism, but everyone is entitled to their opinion. I have just always been taught it's important to point out both strengths and weaknesses. That's what people, professional artists, tell people. It's not to "lessen the blow" it's to reinforce the individuals strengths and push them towards implanting those into where they are weak.
Reply
:iconpeachshark:
peachshark Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I don't mean that it's bad to include good points in criticism - i just mean it's not a compulsary part, and nor should be expected/required.
People shouldn't be offended in getting constructive critique WITHOUT compliments - it's still critique.
i was just trying to point on the differences between just insulting/flaming critiques and critiques that don't lavish the person in praise.
Reply
:iconseraphim-art:
Seraphim-Art Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
It's not a critique if it's lavishing someone in praise? I don't think that qualifies as real critique myself, to be honest. I've seen a few that use the critique system and practically just rant about how great the picture is, and that's not criticism.

You are technically right, though. You don't have to "compliment" someone, but usually pointing out a strong point helps them to know you don't outright hate it, and to establish that they have a strength. It's more of a common courtesy than a requirement and a necessity, I think, is what my point is? I've certainly never heard any guide to critique or professional artist tell me it's a requirment, but they have stated over and over that it's a good way to earn rapporteur between artist and critic. -shrug-

Of course, I guess I don't see compliments in critique straight out? It's nice to hear someone say 'You've improved a lot on this, and I feel like you have a strong point in this but this and this needs improved, and here are my suggestions on how to do so' which is how I learned to give critique. And how I find tends to be the most helpful and informative.
Reply
:iconpeachshark:
peachshark Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
i agree that using the strengths is a good water to contrast and back up the weaknesses. like, you don't want the person you're critiquing to just take your critique is hate.

i guess to simplify, i don't believe in dressing up a critique with praise just so you don't feel bad pointing out the mistakes
Reply
:iconseraphim-art:
Seraphim-Art Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
I agree.
C:
Reply
:iconladyrans:
LadyRans Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
About the friend thing, I do agree. Maybe a lot have jealousy therfore being cocky. I'm not friends with a lot of popular artists, but on my two seperate accounts, its a bit odd. I perhaps say my closest friends on this sight are =BeesHoneypot~ArrangedShenanigans and =gingie-lily since I talk and help them out a lot. But most of my watchers are like my friends as well. :meow:
Reply
:iconpeachshark:
peachshark Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
i've gotten a few notes/comments about people asking to be friends
i don't mean like, 'hello, how are you' i mean like
'can we be friends?"
THAT"S NOT HOW FRIENDSHIP WORKS.

i, as a person, do not get on with a lot of people. a lot of the people i'm friends with on dA was an accidental thing (tamako, costmary, bees, bonestuck) like we collabed or complimented each other and it just...happened
i don't generally set out to make friends?
and that offends people, apparently
Reply
:iconladyrans:
LadyRans Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Ouch, really it isnt how friendship works. I've had people asking me to watch them back. :stare:

Same with me, I dont go out and talk, I'm very shy. I'll leave a compliment, but usually it happens as we just begin talking then it sparks. lol
Reply
:iconsockjuice:
sockjuice Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Student Digital Artist
on the subject of "demanding/ordering instead of asking" it fills me with RAGE when people aren't courteous when asking for adoptables. "I'll take x." is not courteous. Being blunt in your way of typing online is fine but jesus christ, that's a statement, not a request, as it should be. i always feel like saying "no u fuckin wont" whenever people do this ghhhh
Reply
:iconpeachshark:
peachshark Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
YEAH i ahte that
its like
in the same vein as people who get pissed when you give an adopt they offered on to a friend
like
eeeeeeeeeeeeeeEEEEXCUUUUUUUUUUUSE YOU
i don't OWE you that adopt until you've paid
Reply
:iconskudges:
skudges Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012
yeah that thing about constructive criticism is so true. a ton of people get angry when others point out places they could improve and accuse people of flaming, but flaming is more...nonsensical and unjustified rudeness. ;______; yeah people, constructive criticism doesn't mean only positive comments about what you're doing well, it means pointing out good and/or bad points in order to help you improve!! I wish more people understood that.
Reply
:iconcostmary:
costmary Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
PREACH
Reply
:iconcelestecorinne:
CelesteCorinne Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Professional Photographer
I couldn't agree more.
Reply
:iconelindielforeststar:
ElindielForestStar Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Photographer
Ah, that wasn't a nasty journal. XD Some very good points mentioned!
Reply
:iconsongoflives:
SongOfLives Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012
The good point I have seen too many people acting like that
Reply
:iconpsycho-neko-chan:
psycho-neko-chan Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Student Writer
Good journal is good.
Reply
:iconasinglebarofsoap:
asinglebarofsoap Featured By Owner Nov 10, 2012  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Even though only a bit of this has happened to myself, it annoys me just to read all of this. It's hard to believe some people are so low as to say/do those things.
Reply
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